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The obligatory Harry Potter thread (Spoiler warning)

Started by DeeCaudill, July 22, 2007, 09:26:40 AM

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DeeCaudill

I decided that if I wanted to read the last Harry Potter book without it getting spoiled, I'd better do it soon.  So I scared up a copy yesterday and read it.  Now I'm going to put some comments and opinions which will definitely be spoilers.  So if you want to preserve the experience, read no further.  Don't say I didn't warn you.

















Overall, it was capably done.  Which one exception, there is no sort of modernist ambivalence to how things turn out.  This is the first of the series which I found unsatisfactory in so many ways, and I was forcibly reminded that this is, after all, a kid's book.  Most of the things I found wanting were dealing with character deaths.

Hedwig. 

First death of a character I actually know, if you count animals.  We'll forget the Muggle studies teacher who I couldn't remember at all.  I'm sure Rowling did this for two reasons: 1.  to demonstrate how serious the adventure has become (unnecessary after Dumbledore's death); 2.  Because the owl would have been too inconvenient for matters of plot.  The second point is crucial, because the main trio of Harry, Ron, and Hermione (HRH) spend most of the book isolated from the world.

Mad Dog Mooney.

Fast on the heels of Hedwig, Mad Dog meets his end.  This one appears to be once again for plot convenience.  Via the melodramatic formula, Rowling needs to make things appear more and more dire.  Mad Dog is clearly the most powerful remaining member of the Order of the Phoenix.  Ergo, he has to die.  Unfortunately, Rowling erred in her execution (if you'll forgive the pun)--he gets killed "off stage" and the death is only related second-hand.  This means the death lacks emotional impact, and only serves as a function plot necessity.

Dobby

This is probably the only effective death in the entire book.  Dobby dies heroically and we actually get to see it first-hand through Harry.  It's the only death that had an emotional impact to me.  Granted, Dobby is nothing more than Deus Ex Machina when HRH are trapped in the Malfoys' basement.  Oh my, everyone evil underestimates elf magic?  Convenient loophole, to be sure...

Fred, or was it George?

More importantly, do we actually care?  They have always had one role in the Potter books:  comedic relief, that important diffusion that has roots as far back as Hamlet's gravedigger.  Killing the fool is pointless, and his death rang hollow.  Especially since Rowling made such a big deal out of the difficulty of telling him apart from his brother.

Miscellaneous Hogwarts students

Lots of bodies, no emotion impact.  None of the faculty seems to have been harmed.  Somehow, that seems wrong.

Snape

Snape has been marked for death since book one.  The only thing that was important for him as a character was finding out exactly where he stood.  Rowling has handled this character exceptionally well, even though he has always been an obvious red herring.  Even his death is appropriate--at the hands of Voldemort and he hardly puts up a struggle.  Yet, he still wins.

Remus Lupin and Tonks (and Tonks's father)

These two irritate me the most.  Their entire plotline is contrived in an attempt to make their death tragic.  We're told in the prologue that Belatrix has it out for them, they've been married, and have their first child.  Oh dear, now there's another Voldemort orphan.  If their deaths were to have an emotion impact, why did they happen off-stage?  We never even get the story of how they fell.  Why?  They're strawmen, because...

HRH

One of them should have died because they are some of the only characters that we would have had truely mourned as readers.  But Rowling opted not to pull the trigger.  We'll ignore Harry's "death" for now.  I think she made the right decision considering the audience of the book, but that doesn't make it satisfactory for an adult reader. 

She arbitrarily brushes away the jealousy in this love triangle that has been building for three books--I count that as another mistake.  Internal struggle would have put the ending in even more doubt.  Instead, it means that Hermione and Ron are eventually superfluous to the plot.  Rowling even dumps them out of the story once they become a hinderance--they go their own way at Hogwarts and they have no direct role in the final confrontation with Voldemort.  I think it's because one or both of the had to die if the trio stood against Voldemort, and Rowling can't kill her babies.

Harry

Does anyone else start to begruge him for having to experience the story through his POV?  Because of Rowling's rigid adherence to his POV, far too much happens off-stage in this book.

Ginny

She's a trophy.  No depth, not allowed to act in a positive or visible way.  Maybe those claims about Rowling's anti-feminist tendencies aren't far off.  I'll leave you with a prediction for the sixth or seventh movie:  either Ginny gets recast or CGI'd into a much better-looking trophy.

The Ambivalent Redemption of Draco

I suggested this possibility to a family member after finishing the sixth book.  I always thought Draco would win some sort of redemption.  And there we see him 19 years later herding his kids to Hogwarts.  This wasn't as developed as I had hoped it would be, but it was nice to see Rowling deliver what she did when she could have turned him into fodder.

Plot-holes and loose ends--Help me with these if you can. 

How did Snape know when to send his patronus to HRH when they were evading discovery for months?

What happened to Mundingus after HRH kidnapped him?

How did Godric's sword get back into the sorting hat for Neville to pull out?

Luna doesn't deserve a spot in the afterward?  Boo!

Viktor vs. Luna's father.  We never find out how that bit of conflict was concluded.
Guybrarian

Sagacity

Definitely agreed about Fred.  I think Percy would have been a better choice ... he realizes his mistake, and then sacrifices his life to make up for it.  Fred was just pointless.

Also agreed that too many of the deaths happen off-camera, they don't have any real impact that way.  Lupin and Tonks also seemed extremely artificial.  We didn't "participate" in any part of their lives -- didn't see their wedding, didn't meet their baby, didn't see their interaction at all, other than someone now and then telling Harry "this happened".  So when they also die, again off-camera, it seems meaningless.  They feel like stick figures who were just forcibly given a bit of story only to be killed off.

How Snape knew when and where to leave the sword -- the portrait of Phiease Nigellus told him, I think.  Page 689.  Then Dumbledore sent Snape off to leave it.  I guess he got more details, if he needed them, either then or just after that scene.

Overall I enjoyed it, and it wrapped the series up nicely, but it also felt a bit forced in a lot of places as if she was methodically tying up loose ends and forcing the plot along without much elegance at times.  And the final epilogue was nice, but didn't really tell us what anyone ended up doing as professions.  Apparently none of Hermione, Ron, Harry, Ginny, nor Draco are teaching at Hogwarts... more details about what they actually ARE doing would have been nice.  And a bit less ambiguity about Draco's reformation (or not).

DeeCaudill

I think you're right about Phineaus Nigellus.  Still seems a tad sketchy.

I'd also add that the whole Gringott's thing felt like an excuse for splashy special effects in the film, whenever it comes out.  I'd count the whole deal with the goblin as another loose end.  It feels like it must have been written at one point, but didn't make it into the final draft.

For the record, this was the first Harry Potter book I actually bought.  The rest I borrowed.
Guybrarian

Dicey Reilly

I have to say, knowing that people were going to be dying really detached me from the deaths.  I kept saying oh, so that's who dies all the way until the end.  I don't think I cared about anyone who died at the time they died.  Dobby was the closest thing that I came to finding that connection, but it wasn't near the level of when Dumbledore or Sirius died.  The epilogue at the end was the first real emotional attachment I had to a death in this, when Harry is talking to Albus about where he would get sorted.  I have to say that I loved the epilogue.

I also have to say that I liked Ron's part with the locket.  All the insecurity he had about being in Harry's shadow the whole 7 books was worth it.  I don't think that they could have made a larger love triangle, because they never gave any indication that Harry and Hermione had feelings for each other, and you need more then one person feeling those conflicted feelings to have an effective love triangle.

I would have loved to see more of Ginny.  She was way to passive in this book.  At least on stage.  You hear that she was active in the DA and with the trying to steal the sword, but on stage she was very passive.  She's stronger then that, and I didn't like that the way that she came off.

I loved Mrs. Weasley's part at the end.  Stronger then the worried hen she always appeared to be.  That was good.

Parts of the book seemed very rushed and forced.  Like she was trying to keep with the whole school year, even though there was not really a need to stick to that same time frame with the main character's not in school.  Other parts were very well paced.

I think PoV wasn't the only issue with keeping some of the action off to the side.  The book was long for the targeted audience as it was.  If she included all that I would have wanted to have seen and not just seen mentioned, then there was no way she would have been able to finish the series in this one book.

Okay, that's about all I can think of off the top of my head, but I liked the book over all.  The storyline was good, and parts made me laugh.  Not perfect, but good.

Sagacity


tanare

Damn Sagacity, i can't believe they ripped off Harry's death like that. Dead, then gets better. JK better sue if she was smart!

i was expecting one of the trinity to die as well. In fact that was the biggest drama of the whole book for me. The rest of the deaths, i agree would have been better to be "on camera" than off. And hey one of the professors died, Snape- granted completely different circumstances but still. I suppose you could argue, the professers knew what they were doing better than the students so they survived, but yeah i thought some of them would get killed off.

I do like at the very end that Harry does decide to honor Snape's behind the scenes support/sacrifices after all their difficulites throughout the series. I do  appreciate Snape's difficulites with his relationship to Harry-- he loved Lily so he would do almost anything to help her child as a final sign of his devotion, yet at the same time despising James, whom Harry just happens to look exactly like to remind Snape of all the harrassment he suffered at James' hands when he was younger.

I was actually cracking up with Albus' reactions at the end after james was teasing him about his sorting though. Ah big brothers...

Wroethgar

Well, I have mixed feelings. 

I liked it very much.

It was rushed.

But what it comes down to for me, as an avid reader of adult male oriented novels. ( and not the dirty ones ).

This is a War novel.  Rowling is not at all a war novel writer.  I think all the failings we all feel stem from this fact.  The off screen deaths are a part of this inexperience and inability in this genre.

Fred's death absolutely did strike me, but would have been wildly more effective if we had seen the true and deeper reaction of George, his constant companion and business partner.  I also would have liked to learn about George's life in the epilogue.

Was noone excited to see Neville finally seem to stand on his own and take charge and kick some ass?  I imagine him hurling mandrakes by their stem overhand like German WW2 grenades, and wielding the tantaculas like some sort of mystical handgun. 

Albus' name in the epilogue should have been Severus.  It was a backhanded, half assed tribute to Snape, and belittled the ultimate realization that his entire adult life had been spent fighting Voldemort and defending Harry, albeit for a misguided reason. 

And, I believe that Harry and Ginny, as well as Ron and Hermione live in the muggle world full time, even though it isn't stated, and I love that.

I wish she had said something about Harry having a relationship with Dudley.

I love that Petunia hated magic because she was jealous she didn't have it.

What is the next Harry Potter world project you would like to see?

Oh, and when Lupin and Tonks died, it was the only time I actually teared up in the book.  I know it happened off camera, but it took me by surprise that both would die, and I really like them.


tanare

well the next plan appears to be sort of setup.

Harry Potter- the next generation.

i think making severus the middle name was more of Harry liking Dumbledor a lot more than he liked Snape so it was a "well i should honor him somehow but i REALLY don;t want to put him ahead of Dumbledor." choice. I think if JK decided to give Harry three sons she would have made Severus the first name of that one...unless she decided she needed to put Sirius there instead.

Yeah i was kind of wondering what happened to the Dursleys after they took off. JK did an interview recently somewhere saying that even though she tried to cover all the main ones she couldn;t possibly tie up every last loose end there was without making the book much longer so she had to pick and choose and stuck to tying up the main ones instead.

Oh and do not mess with a Weasley mother after one of her sons gets killed....  :viking2:   :mf_swordfight:  that was one of my favorite moments too.

DeeCaudill

I will admit that my favorite line in the book may be when Kreacher is hitting Mundungus over the head with a pot and says "Maybe one more time for luck?"

What I think ultimately detracted from the novel was Rowling's insistence on staying with a 3rd-person POV focused on Harry.  Granted, that's how all the other books are written aside from the prologue chapters.

I've been thinking of specific areas where I would have like to have seen another character's point of view:

During the defense of Hogwarts, I would have loved following any of the students or faculty to get a sense of the chaos.  Neville might be the top choice.

Following Ron & Hermione down to the Chamber of Secrets--big blooper there according to the die-hard fans.  They had to ride Fawkes out of there to escape the last time.

Following Remus Lupin after Harry told him off and seeing his return to Tonks.
Guybrarian

tanare

Quote from: DeeCaudill on July 27, 2007, 06:55:09 AM


Following Ron & Hermione down to the Chamber of Secrets--big blooper there according to the die-hard fans.  They had to ride Fawkes out of there to escape the last time.


that reminds me. Though the Fawkes thing would make it a bit clearer. So let me get this straight. there's been a rotting basilik stuck under the school grounds for what 5 or 6 years? Mr.Finch really isn;t doing his job if he's letting that thing sit there and rot away. The smell alone would be pretty bad at this time. maybe they used wizardly air fresheners to mask the stench.  Good thing the basilisk poison/blood didn;t dry up or evaporate in all that time too.

but still you'd think someone would want that cleaned up....

Namae Nai

Quote from: tanare on July 27, 2007, 10:38:30 AMthat reminds me. Though the Fawkes thing would make it a bit clearer. So let me get this straight. there's been a rotting basilik stuck under the school grounds for what 5 or 6 years? Mr.Finch really isn;t doing his job if he's letting that thing sit there and rot away. The smell alone would be pretty bad at this time. maybe they used wizardly air fresheners to mask the stench.  Good thing the basilisk poison/blood didn;t dry up or evaporate in all that time too.

but still you'd think someone would want that cleaned up....

Well, I think part of the reason that wasn't a problem was because the Chamber was covertly sponsored by a womens deodorant company you may have heard of....  :P
Namae Nai, Wandering Troubadour, 60,000,000,000$$ reward!

Titia

Just finished the book. Overall I prefered the previous one because it felt better thought of and not, as a few already said, a line up of scenes for a five stars live action movie (the final battle in the shcool will do nicely). The book is too kind in the end and feels like JK didn't want to kill the gold strain after all.

Character deaths, while not unexpected, sound artificial mostly because we don't see them first hand. Moreover as pages pass and dead characters pile up I felt like Harry was more and more detached, like not really caring after all. One a side note we know it's Fred who dies because of his missing ear. Harry's (un)death lacks drama and it's not Hagrid's presence that will cover for it. I believe Hermione or Ron should have died early onso we could have felt serious threat and concern for the final chapters.

I don't buy the Malfoy's mother and Harry play dead plot. Deatheaters have seen enough corpses in their life to know whenever someone plays or is dead.

The book also felt like JK absolutely needed to have every single character she made appear. Tonk and Lupin are a good example since they don't have any relevant weigth on the events and are only there for the show. On the other hand other characters needed more development like Luna, Jenny or Albus's brother and lack it.. they become flat and while they have replaced Ron and Hermione. This is something that bother me: maybe the plot would have been more interesting if the three had ben separated from start and Harry would have found himself with other less developped characters (like Luna or Neuville). Comparison betweens trios from Harry's perspective would have been effective and all characters would have been enhanced by other aspects of their personnality. Unfortunately we have the usual main characters playing mostly their main personality.

I'm sorry to say but I prefer the evil character developments. While not unexpected, Snape's real story finished an already well made and interesting character and fills the gaps. There are many contradictions in Snape's personality which makes him sound real. He is by far the most courageous one in the end also for all we know he had to endure. Draco's storyline could have had a better development but redemption was not unexpected, it is more surprising for his father though.

The finla duel is well written although there is something I don't get: I don't see how Draco could have become the master of the Wand since he's not killed nor taken it off Albus in the previous book. This is a key fact that concerns me.

Chamber of secrets: there is a broomstick mentionned in Ron's hand when he and Hermione come back. As for the smell.. the chamber leads to the sewers so not much bad smell added there.  It is also far beneath the castle. The only thing convenient is Ron remembering 5 years after the password in snake tongue... what a nice memory for a second grade student.

Epilogue: nothing unexpected there. The death of Ron or Hermione would have given a bit more drama on the scene and push the new generation, while there it sounds like a family reunion.

As for Harry's whereabout, I read in a newspaper interview of JK a few years ago (I think it was for the previous book) that she we imagining a few adventures of him once he became an Auroch. First of all it kind of killed the final plot to me, second I wouldn't be surprised if we see a few independant Harry Potter books in the future.

Lyrima

The off camera deaths didn't bother me at all because of Dee's original point.  I spent most of my time reading it thinking of my own children (10 and 8 yo), trying to read from their perspective.

Those deaths were POWERFUL to my children, but not upsetting. I think JK did a very nice job of that.  Remember, as adults, I doubt any of us read and reread these books.  My children did.  Both read the entire series this spring before it came out, then went back and read individual books again while waiting.  My daughter is still rereading as, right after finishing the last one, she pulled out the first one and started reading again.

She commented that it was 'sad' to read the words and actions of those who had died.

JK was writing for too many audiences.  She wanted this book to be dark and dire and for the older of her readers (young adults, probably, the 17 and 18 year olds who started with her so young)  but she knew NEW 7 and 8 year olds would be reading it.  She had to walk a fine line on that one.

It never occurred to me that one of the trio would die.  That would have been horrific and deeply traumatic for my children...Nooo no.  She made a wise choice there.

Snape was obvious to me, but I liked how she laid it out in the pensieve.  His final death mirrored Harry's death at the hands of Vody, and I appreciated (again as an adult reading child fiction) how this hated man became Harry's final role model.  How to take death without struggle and with dignity.

I found the ending, where Harry dies and returns trite.  Clearly a christian approach (Jesus' crucifiction/rising from the dead) and a copy, frankly, of The Lion, The Witch and the Wardrobe's Aslan.... which most of her young audience will know from either the movie or the book.  My daughter might remember because she read TLTW&TW a year or so ago, but we never allowed our children to see the movie.

Having said I was disappointed with the ending for myself, I know my children will have soaked up the message about bravery, sacrifice and love winning over all.  They will mull and find power in those concepts...and I am grateful to Rowling for making it so thought provoking for them. 

I remember reading the scene with Aslan and sobbing as a child, every time I reread the book, and I think the same will be true for my children.  Of course CS Lewis made the death of Aslan deeply powerful for me as a child by having him horribly teased and reviled (his version was much more a copy of the story of Jesus...something I believe CS Lewis freely admitted)

Overall, I was amazed at how thoroughly obsessed I was with this book.  I really enjoyed the Half Blood Prince as well.  The fifth book I hated.  I can't remember why, but I could not stand it.  That 5th book will probably stop me from ever rereading the entire series.

I found Harry as annoying as usual.  I have never really liked the kid.  Dee made an interesting point...every single book was from Harry's point of view.  No wonder I couldn't stand him!  Far too much time in his head, not enough time learning, first hand, the thoughts and reflections of the others.  I don't see why she *had* to keep it from his POV for all the books.

The parts that made me laugh out loud with surprise and appreciation was, of course, Kreacher's request to smack for luck and at the very end when Ron made a comment about the house elves and Hermione dropped the basilisk horns to throw her arms around him.  In fact, that probably IS my favorite part...it shows growth on Ron's part and Hermione's effect on him.

Btw, I loved the change over in Kreacher. 
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Lyrima - EQ2, ESO, now Baldur's Gate 3
Lark - Storm Trooper SW:TOR
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Titia

QuoteI don't see why she *had* to keep it from his POV for all the books.
Well it's called "Harry Potter and.." the books are about him so getting everthing from his own perspective makes sens. From a writting point of view it allows to lead the reader in false directions for some great spins at the end, only by putting it on Harry misunderstandings or misconceptions.

As for the target audience, it is true it is very broad which makes difficult to content all. Yet I think the core audience are the kids that started reading the first bookaround the same age Harry was. They are what? maybe 17 ot 18 now and should be able to handle more direct and real shifts of event. I though her writing had evolved in parallel but that last book makes me doubt it.

Not being English (hense having no knownledge of classic books) nor being really fond of religion I really didn't see any Christian  approach. Thanks for bringing this.

And I agree, The order of Poenix is the book that will prevent me from re-reding the whole serie. It's twice as big as the next two and very boring. I'd have preferred she took the time and page number needed in this last book, but of course more pages would have made it more difficult to get a movie script out of it :)

tanare

Asar as Draco becoming the master of the wand. I THINK, would have to reread to make certain, that you just had to defeat the wielder of the wand in battle which Draco did when he disarmed Dumbledor in book 6. At least that's how i took it.

Of course then i guess you have to say that once winning his right for the wand by beating Dumbledor, Draco had to stay unbeaten even though he didn;t use the wand or even have it when Harry beat him. So i suppose that means if someone were to disarm Harry in any sort of wizardly duel, they would become the master of the wand even though Harry didn;t use it.

So if that's the case Harry's not  right when he talks about ending the curse by reburying the wand with Dumbledor so no one else could ever claim it by defeating Harry in the future. He can still lose the right by being disarmed in any duel with any wand whether he lives or dies though it, if my theory is accurate.

Wroethgar

I just reread it, Harry says, "So if I die unbeaten and peacefully" or sommat.

Effectively, he's trying to do what Dumbledore failed, and die without ever losing a battle. 

Lyrima

Hm. I disagree.

The wand, in its history, was passed from one master to another through thievery too.  Remember one of the owners had it stolen from him out of an Inn room?

The whole wand thing was pretty weak for those paying attention to the details.  Of course, since I don't really pay attention to details unless a conversation like this occurs, I thought the whole wand thing was GREAT while reading the book. Heh.
~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^
Lyrima - EQ2, ESO, now Baldur's Gate 3
Lark - Storm Trooper SW:TOR
Kiaria - Warden EQ2, ESO
Tira l'Arc - Ranger/Healer HZ/ EQ2, ESO
Athen'a - TankArcher AC

Anaris

Ok, just finished reading the book...  I just have to say.......wow.  I...guess I was reading a different book?

I got a completely different take on this book.  And I quite liked it, but for totally different reasons than my 10-year-old cousin...


JK Rowling managed to make the Armenian Genocide, the Holocaust, the Balkan War, Milosevic's followers, the Hutu/Tutsi conflict, the political struggles in South America in the '60s, Che Guevara, Darfur, and the Inquisition into a nice and fun way for kids to learn about ethnic cleansing, politicide, tyranny, human and civil rights violations, and religious persecution without actually having to know gory details (till they're old enough).

I mean, was it just my jaded post-graduate International Relations bias, or were the Death Eaters using political propaganda akin to that of Rwandan radio shows in the 90's dehumanizing Tutsis, and Nazi propaganda demonizing Jews??

She did her research...  Reading the book was like a warped Disney version of Pinochet's rise to power and the left-winged students he tortured and killed along the way...  Or Stroessner in Argentina...  Or Pol Pot in Cambodia...  Or Franco in Spain...   Or...well, too many places, really...

But you know what, I'm so glad she did, and that it's for children...  Maybe it'll actually get people to talk about it, and younger generations to contemplate the possibilities of it so it doesn't happen again... I mean, yes, I know everyone said it wouldn't happen again after WWII but it's happened, oh, like, seven times since.....   And that's just the ones we know about... 

The scary part was when she used the term "cockroach" to describe a "Mudblood"....  That was a term Hutus used to describe educated Tutsis....  I wonder if that was done intentionally by Rowling...  The Muggle Registration Commission?  oh my god, that's been a tactic in like 5 genocides already...  Star of David, anyone?  Identification cards stating your enthicity and religion, anyone?  Registration of political party followed by a midnight kidapping to never been seen again, anyone?  Baptism records, anyone?

All that stuff about torture, Azkaban acting as a prison for anyone who violated the new political regime, the arresting for questionings, the persecution of familly members of those who were opposed to the regime and took action, the activism at the school, clandestine organizations (Dumbledore's Army, Order of the Phoenix), vandalizing the school to spread subliminal revolutionary messages, kidnappings (specifically dragging Luna off the Hogwart's express and keeping her a prisoner because of her father's renegade anti-Death Eater show), the Potterwatch radio show (very Civil Rights Movement, John Lennon would've been proud!), and sooo much more...  All that stuff definitely borrows a lot from the 1960's and 1970's when so much of that was going on all over the world (Eastern Europe, South America, even here a little bit)...  JK Rowling was a teenager at that time, no?  She must remember some stuff and it must have affected her...  Heck, this was happening in the late 1990's in Yugoslavia... Not that long ago...

I can't wait till my dad reads it, I was telling him about the book and he got it so he started reading it already.  He dealt with all that stuff in the 60's and lived through a similar revolution.  I know reading it from the viewpoint of something inteded for children will really amuse him...

She definitely borrowed the most from the Nazis and WWII...  If I remember correctly from my college years, there was this little document created by Nazis back in the 1930's to determine just how "Jewish" a Jew was...  I believe it was called the Nuremberg Laws...  Basically, they tried to scientifically answer the question of Jewishness by checking a person's grandparents.  If you had four grandparents that were German, then you were pure Aryan blood...  If you had 3-4 grandparents that were Jew, then you were Jewish blood...  If you had 1-2 grandparents that were Jew, then you were "mixed blood"....  Then they passed "Laws of the Protection of German Blood" which prohibited mixed marriages, sex, and reproduction between Germans and Jews...

It's like, I can't wait till I have children and they start learning about these things and then they come to ask me more, I'll be like "remember when you were six and you read the final Potter book and...."  Well, ya know where that conversation would be headed....

;)

EQ2: Luxelen, Anaris, Nixabella   GW2: Aramaia.4365

Lyrima

You make really good points and I did realize she was making those connections as well.

It is so cool you are here to bring it out like that...I surely know significantly less than you do about these things.  I will certainly use it as a jumping off point for my children :) thank you for pointing it all out!

JK Rowling said she did that on purpose but tried to keep it ...well, exactly as you said... a tool for teaching without the gory details.

They spoke only briefly about it during her interview on MSNBC.

Excellent points Ana! :smitten:
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Lyrima - EQ2, ESO, now Baldur's Gate 3
Lark - Storm Trooper SW:TOR
Kiaria - Warden EQ2, ESO
Tira l'Arc - Ranger/Healer HZ/ EQ2, ESO
Athen'a - TankArcher AC

Askari

I found the series ending satisfactory, but also thought some of it was rushed and a bit "off".

For instance, there was the complete non sequitor scene where Remus turns up at Bill and Fleur's just long enough to say Tonks had the kid and they want Harry to be the godfather. I said to myself, "Well, that's sort of out of nowhere and doesn't fit in with the story flow... I betcha they both die." Sure enuff!

I thought Hedwig dying was just a cheap, convenient plot device.

I felt that Fred dying could have packed a punch, IF they would have had a reaction shot from George. They were always Fred&George, so to split them up by killing one of a pair of identical twins... could have been heart-wrenching. But his death was just sort of mentioned in passing.

I thought Voldemort summoning the Sorting Hat, putting it on Neville, and lighting it on fire all seemed a little arbitrary and out of character for Voldemort. I would have prefered that Hermione come up with a plan and Ron execute said plan, to give them more chance to shine.

I also thought the whole "who was master of the wand" thing was a little convoluted and strange. I like a clever plot twist, and JKR's had good ones in the past, but this seemed bogus.

I expected more from the epilogue too. I read an article where JKR said she pictured Harry as Head Auror, Hermionie working for the Ministry in the Division of Magical Beings, and Ron becoming partners with George in the joke shop.

I found it interesting that a focus of the epilogue was Albus Severus Potter (his initials spell asp) starting Hogwarts, and worrying about being sorted into Slytherin.
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